Statistics: Posted by Just Rob — Thu Jun 25, 2009 1:24 pm
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I appreciate the fact that you have taken the time to inform yourself and gone to the trouble to actually read the 4E PHB. I think that was an honest assessment of the material as written... and a valid contribution to this discussion.
However, I think your assessments on certain areas are actually spot on, others... not so much... and your assumptions about what that might mean for gameplay, off base, due, as you admitted to, having not played it.
I could go in to a lot of detail in response to your post, and if you'd like a rebuttal I would do that, but it still isn't going to get to the basic point I have been trying to make, which you mention as well..
You have to play the game for awhile to actually see how all the parts fit together and how things do flow better and fit together in innovative ways, and why that 'game balance' is so important. Synergistic systems can rarely be deduced by reading a manual. It is best something that is experienced.... and after that experience, I believe most of your first impressions you will find were inaccurate.
That said Rob, I have been trying to find any 3E to 4E comparisons that might help you.
Here is a link that I found to be very spot on in most respects... the commentary afterwards is also VERY informative, and unlike a lot of forums on this topic. civil and respectful. Give it a read as I think there are some really great insights on it that respond better than anything I might say...
Statistics: Posted by TheDM — Tue Jun 23, 2009 11:03 pm
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Statistics: Posted by TheDM — Tue Jun 16, 2009 12:00 pm
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And I will confess, playing it opened my eyes a bit.
That being said: I must confess that it felt as though it was just another RPG. I don't mean "just another"--- Let me explain further. I wouldn't give up 3.5E for it, but neither would I refuse to play 4E because I'm playing 3.5E ... unless it was the same gaming group. At the same time, I would not give up 3.5E or 4E for Call of Cthulu, Star Frontiers, Champions, d20 Modern, Star Wars, or Warhammer RPG. And vice versa. It was a fantasy game, plain and simple, and was fun. Each one is different in its own way from all the others, and there are pros and cons to each system. For me, I'm not sure why it has to be an "all-or-nothing" issue.
Most groups with which I'm familiar play a rotating series of games. Granted, that's a lot easier when you're playing weekly (or more). We don't have the time for that. But if I had the time, I'd be more than happy to sit down one week at a 3.5 table, then a Champions table the week after that, then a 4E table the third week, followed by a Star Wars or d20 Modern table the final week, just to start over the following month. Unfortunately, I don't have the time right now. That's not saying that I won't want to -- and won't ask to -- participate in a 4E game when I have time. I will. I simply don't have the free time right now to devote to learning enough so that I am not a liability at the table. To paraphrase Troy's posting on the other thread: "the guy who kicks open the door and invites more monsters onto the scene is not an instigator; neither is the guy who has to ask 5 questions about his character before every action because he doesn't know the rules. These guys are jerks." While I don't feel that way, I know some people may feel that way, and I don't want to be the jerk.
ASIDE: Troy, I will agree with one other thing: I do miss rolling the dice. Heck, I carry a d20 in my pocket everywhere I go. (Yes, I do.) I'm trying to decide whether I can work it with DMGenie somehow.
I miss the sound, I miss the feel, I miss the emotion. /ASIDETo add a "limited ditto" to Lorin's thoughts: Troy, I value your friendship and as far as I'm concerned, you've always got a place around the table. Your expertise and imagination will surely be missed if this is, in fact, your final decision. I'll be sorry about that. I hope that I will have a place around your table when time permits, whatever it may be that you're running. I too loved Dragon Mountain; Boric and his companions will always have a special place in my heart. I appreciate the chance to be the Propmaster, and hope that you know you can call on my meager talents in that respect whenever you wish. ... there may be a charge, of course....Unions and all that, you know... (grin)
Statistics: Posted by Boric Glanduum — Thu Jun 04, 2009 4:20 pm
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